Doctor Who: Radio Free Skaro

15 Responses to “Radio Free Skaro #178 – Fnargengruven”

1. Tsuliwaensis
   January 24th, 2010 at 4:06 PM

   

   you can’t be serious, guys! I just heard your comments about joss whedon shows, I’m in shock. you are clever guys, appreciate things that are different and challenging, how can you not love joss whedon and everything he ever did? it just doesn’t make sense… what’s wrong with you?

   firefly bored you? bored?!
   my soul just threw up a little… you’re killing me…

2. Ranger1138
   January 25th, 2010 at 7:18 AM

   

   Nothing carried over from Torchwood? The hand! Sure that happened in the Christmas Invasion, however, Jack’s use of it carried over loads into Doctor Who.

3. Chris
   January 25th, 2010 at 12:41 PM

   

   The hand originated in Doctor Who.

4. Todd
   January 28th, 2010 at 7:14 AM

   

   I think Ranger1138 gets the point on that one. The bubbling hand jar was brought over from Torchwood.
   Now, I do not expect everyone to love everything I love, and actually quite like it when I feel that a show I love is “mine” and others don’t get it, but your comments regarding Joss Whedon shows struck me as a bit more dismissive and uninformed. “I don’t watch Buffy because I am not a teenage girl that needs to feel empowered [or something to that effect]“? Sorry, but #$@% you. That was just a lame conversation.

5. Tsuliwaensis
   January 28th, 2010 at 9:07 AM

   

   I totally understand people having trouble to get into buffy, the 1st season is really hard to go through without being tempted to give up if you haven’t seen it while being a teenager yourself. but the 2nd season already shows more promise and after that it’s just awesome.

   what I really don’t understand is how you guys don’t get the rest. how about dr. horrible? ever watched that? it’s only about 45 mins. long, not too much to ask, right? so you try that and then we’ll talk again.

6. Chris
   January 28th, 2010 at 3:24 PM

   

   @Todd – To be fair (and nitpicky, the best way to be) the jar was introduced in Torchwood but the hand originated in Doctor Who (as Ranger1138 noted). The hand is the important aspect there, so that makes it a DW element rather than a Torchwood element to me.

   I was the one who said the teenage girl/empowerment/heroine bit and that aspect went a looooong way to Buffy’s popularity on the female side of the fence. I have zero idea what the draw was for the male fans but I know there are tons of them out there. The show’s got a massive UK following and I got to know loads of Buffy fans in my time over there. Personally, I watched the first few episodes and absolutely nothing grabbed me – not writing, not acting, nothing. It’s been suggested to me that I need to not start from the start and watch a few select episodes from throughout the run to really get into it. Given that same philosophy is often (rightly) applied to Doctor Who, I can understand it completely. Nowadays I’d not want to start someone off with the first three Doctor Who stories and expect them to take a shine to the series as a result. I’d want to get in the City of Deaths, the Talons of Weng-Chiangs and so on to sell the series.

   The comments were very much dismissive and uninformed – it’s very difficult to be otherwise when none of us have really seen any Whedon shows, really. I’m not in the least apologetic for my opinion though, as I did try to watch Buffy, I have seen the original movie (though that doesn’t much count relative to the TV series), and it failed to grab me. It failed to grab a majority of people.

   Why do you like Buffy? What grabbed you about it? What made it a special part of your past?

   @Tsuliwaensis – Obviously different people will have different opinions however I’ve heard a lot of division about what’s best in the series. Many say the early years are where it’s at and it falters after that, many say the complete opposite. In my case the early years were dull, dull, dull – for as much as I saw – and perhaps had I stuck with it I’d have fallen into the “the later years are best” camp. It’s hard to say.

   I’ve watched Dr Horrible and it was cute but due to the musical nature of it there’s almost zero chance the others will have seen it or ever see it. When I did watch it, I did so chiefly for Neil Patrick Harris as I’d heard he did a remarkable job. I didn’t care in the slightest that it was Whedon (and his brother) behind it all.

7. Tsuliwaensis
   January 29th, 2010 at 2:57 AM

   

   “I was the one who said the teenage girl/empowerment/heroine bit and that aspect went a looooong way to Buffy’s popularity on the female side of the fence. I have zero idea what the draw was for the male fans but I know there are tons of them out there. ”

   wow.
   are you really saying that a strong female lead character can only be interesting to a female audience?

   well, in that case we don’t need to discuss this any further… cause if you really believe that then we just found the reason why joss whedon shows won’t work for you. I honestly didn’t think that could even be an option for an explanation, very disappointing.

   nevermind the fact that female strength is just one little aspect of the show. but if the gender of the lead is already reason enough for you to not be interested in the show it really doesn’t make sense to tell you what else you’re missing out on…

8. Chris
   January 29th, 2010 at 3:17 AM

   

   No, that’s not at all what I said. I clearly said it was one aspect and that I didn’t know what drew the male fans to the show but that there are many. To expand upon those facets, I’ve honestly never asked male fans I’ve known what drew them to the show but indeed I’ve had female fans tell me they appreciated a strong female lead character.

   I appreciate the fervour with which you’re trying to defending the show but please don’t twist my words.

   Nevertheless I’ll cease opening my yap on this simply because I didn’t/don’t watch the show, didn’t/don’t see the appeal despite giving it a go, and for yourself and others who did/do watch and did/do see the appeal then by all means continue to enjoy the show for whatever you see in it; anything I can say or have said won’t take away from that. There are obviously reasons why the show ran for as many years as it did, spun off, and has a worldwide following — but it just didn’t grab me.

9. Tsuliwaensis
   January 29th, 2010 at 6:12 AM

   

   “I clearly said it was one aspect and that I didn’t know what drew the male fans to the show”

   yes, see? you’re excluding it to be the aspect that draws male fans to the show when it clearly is one of the obvious ones. buffy was one of the first shows that turned the “male predator – female victim”-scenario around. it was something fresh and new and exciting. it proofed that male fans can relate to female heroines just as female fans can relate to male heroes. if you have complex characters, good storytelling and a rich mythology it really isn’t that hard to fall in love with the concept. if I still misunderstand you, you need to rephrase what you’re saying. but I’d be just as happy to let it go.

10. freyburg
    January 29th, 2010 at 8:07 AM

    

    I actually quite liked Doctor Horrible. But like Chris and Steven, I tried watching Buffy, Angel and Firefly, and each one of them bored me to tears.

11. Tsuliwaensis
    January 29th, 2010 at 8:55 AM

    

    hahaha! oh, come on… that’s like saying you’re “bored” by the works of charlie kaufman, tim burton or david lynch. but if you’re serious I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s actually the case.

12. jsd
    January 29th, 2010 at 7:13 PM

    

    Count me as a fellow Whedon fanatic. Buffy S2 & S3 are worth watching all the way through. S4 is mainly OK but it goes downhill hard after that. Angel is good from S2 pretty much straight through to the end.

    Dollhouse has been really really patchy but the best of it is amazing.

    As to what drew me (male) to Buffy, it was the great writing and characterization. And hey, hot chicks beating the crap out of monsters doesn’t hurt either!

13. Todd
    January 31st, 2010 at 10:58 AM

    

    Chris,

    Thank you for your thoughtful response. I do appreciate it. I want to point out that I wasn’t so much offended by you picking on the shows of Whedon (I am quite comfortable with people not loving what I love), but rather taking the extra step of inferring what “type” of person, who you are not, is a fan.

    One really can’t argue against a “I’ve watched some and what I saw was boring” review. That is just a difference in taste, and you have every right to that. Lord knows I have some friends, and at times even my girlfriend, who have the same thoughts about our dear Doctor Who. It’s fine, and actually sometimes adds to my enjoyment (in North American, you can feel a little possessive of Doctor Who, like you would love a band that nobody’s heard of. Then it is fun to introduce them to it). I really liked Buffy, enjoyed the heck out of the last couple seasons of Angel, adored Firefly/Serenity, have watch Dr. Horrible more times then is natural, and found Dollhouse to be flawed and mostly boring and illogical. See, we can agree on one Whedon series there. Whedon, especially in Buffy and Angel, set up characters who grew stronger with each episode, who you care about, while mostly working within a “monster of the week” framework. The parallels to RTD’s work on DW are strongly acknowledged by RTD himself. So I am surprised that you didn’t like it. But I repeat, I have no problem with that.

    As said the problem is the comments like “I don’t like it because I’m not a teenage girl.” Would I have probably been so annoyed if you had said that about Twilight? Probably not because I am not a fan of that movie and it is marketed directly to that fanbase. But I would still have thought it a low blow. If someone would say something like “I don’t like Radio Free Skaro” because I’m not a socially awkward Canadian with acne” you can see how you would get annoyed . It’s really not a criticism of the show, it is just a mean (and incorrect) assumption about who would even be interested in it. There is no response to that. You just have to say, #%@* you back. Which I did

    So anyways. Sorry to ramble on. I do appreciate the work all three of you do every week. Not that I want you to start charging, but I would pay for this podcast. Thank you for all your hard work.
    Your Whedon-Enjoying Male Skaro-listening Fan,

    Todd

    PS If you are interested in still checking out Buffy, I personally would recommend “Hush” from series 4. . For Angel I recommend “Smile Time” for series 5. For Firefily I would say “Our Mrs. Reynolds” All three are episodes that are built around strong concepts that you don’t need to know much about the show to enjoy. They are my gateway drug episodes I introduce to people to show them the concept and start them on their road to addiction. Much as I do with “Blink” for DW. However, as with Blink, if you watch them and still go “Meh” I will sigh, but will still respect you in the morning.

14. John
    February 3rd, 2010 at 11:43 AM

    

    I’ll just make this quick. Buffy didn’t hit its stride till the 2nd season so if you start from the beginning you probably wouldn’t like it. And it’s in NO WAY just for teenage girls. That was the most inane comment I’ve heard in weeks. Angel was good also and so was Dollhouse. Wheedon does good stuff. The closed-mindedness of this show often amazes me.

    And Fox currently does support Sci-Fi…it’s called Fringe.

15. Chris
    February 3rd, 2010 at 1:49 PM

    

    Indeed, Fox does air Fringe. I even watch Fringe. It’s palatable. Silly, but palatable. Not mentioning it was definitely a regrettable oversight.

    On the topic of Fringe I do hope they get back to more of the lengthy story arcs (alternate universe, Peter’s history, William Bell, etc.) as this Freak of the Week nonsense is getting tiring. Smallville beat that to death 7-8 years ago.